127 replies to this topic

[Keitho]

Cirdan, on 21 February 2010 - 06:00 PM, said:

You do know that the English bid includes 2 stadia in Manchester and 3 (!) in London? Plus, Sunderland and Newcastle are basically the same metropolitan area... I also don't think 2 automatic berths should be much of a problem, both have very strong nts and at least Spain is almost certain to qualify anyway. And Spain and Portugal have the same currency, are/will be well connected by rail and there's basically no border control when traveling between the countrys. The biggest problem I see with the dual approach is that it will be lopsided - 4 stadia in Portugal, 8 in Spain, and if 80k seats are required for both opening match and final, neither one could be held in Portugal.

Yes, I am aware of what the England bid entails. Englands bid at the moment includes 15 venues, 3 of which are in London and 2 in Manchester. This is a work in progress. The likely final scenario will see London nominate 2 and Manchester 1, and probably another casualty which leaves 12. Regarding Spain/Portugal the fact that it is a 'lopsided' bid is the main reason that Portugal should not be granted automatic qualification. Borrowing 2 stadiums from Portugal is enough (Porto & Benfica). Spain could easily fill the gaps. Stadiums such as Malaga and Elche for example are not part of the bid and could be upgraded. The opening/closing games would obviously be held in Spain, but that is not a major issue.
Spain would definitely be my choice as host.

[Tutankamon]

I hope Candidatura Ibérica win for 2018, it would be so good for relations and comunications across Spain and Portugal and dont live more back to back

[SoSie]

My first post here . I'm portuguese by the way.

It's a real surprise to me to see how this thread has simply disapeared from the main page. From what I've seen, the rest of the topic discuss some serious issues, but others are completely negleted. Let me focus on some:

First - By football conditions we start with stadia, acessability and, then, accomodation. Considering iberia, stadia is one of the best in the world. And to discuss stadia, let me put some important facts straight: FIFA » UEFA »»»»»»» Comnenbol, Concacaf, etc... and this is not just about power, is about history, reputation and even football on the pitch. Conditions that UEFA create are bigger, clearer and more demanding than any other in the world. If a stadium has 5 stars from UEFA, it means, for sure, that is one of the best in the whole world. Iberia is the european geographical space with more UEFA 5 stars stadia.
Considering acessability, the ONLY possible problem considering the future event is the high speed link by train that doesn't connect Madrid and Lisbon: all other means of transportantion exist, run and are well preserved. Airports, metro, trains and roads already exist.
Accomodation is an issue for the ignorants: just search for accomadation in any of the possible venues to conclude that all venues match the FIFA requisites.

Second - Football. It is strange to me, and this is an euphimism, to see people from the US, Canada and else, say: Qatar is a good place, or, Australia would be awesome. Of course the first has the means (money, money) and the second the capacity and means (more money money, and the "far away thing" that has a lot of charm), but what about football? Come on guys! Iberia has 18 European club titles, or Champions Leagues, the place to be when you are talking about football clubs. Iberia received, in the last 10 years 7 Best player of the world titles, and two of them were actually born in Iberia (Ronaldo and Figo). Iberia has the second best european cup score, behind Germany. England didn't manage to get to the final. Finally, considering World Cups, yes it is true England already has one title, but besides the phantom goal, certain stadium change issues before the semi final against Portugal are well "underspoken".

Third - How is it possible to be the day before Portugal Spain in Cape Town and nobody has thought of possible implications of this to the Candidatura. I leave the discussion open!

[LuigiVercotti]

SoSie, on 28 June 2010 - 05:51 PM, said:

My first post here . I'm portuguese by the way.

It's a real surprise to me to see how this thread has simply disapeared from the main page. From what I've seen, the rest of the topic discuss some serious issues, but others are completely negleted. Let me focus on some:

First - By football conditions we start with stadia, acessability and, then, accomodation. Considering iberia, stadia is one of the best in the world. And to discuss stadia, let me put some important facts straight: FIFA » UEFA »»»»»»» Comnenbol, Concacaf, etc... and this is not just about power, is about history, reputation and even football on the pitch. Conditions that UEFA create are bigger, clearer and more demanding than any other in the world. If a stadium has 5 stars from UEFA, it means, for sure, that is one of the best in the whole world. Iberia is the european geographical space with more UEFA 5 stars stadia.
Considering acessability, the ONLY possible problem considering the future event is the high speed link by train that doesn't connect Madrid and Lisbon: all other means of transportantion exist, run and are well preserved. Airports, metro, trains and roads already exist.
Accomodation is an issue for the ignorants: just search for accomadation in any of the possible venues to conclude that all venues match the FIFA requisites.

Second - Football. It is strange to me, and this is an euphimism, to see people from the US, Canada and else, say: Qatar is a good place, or, Australia would be awesome. Of course the first has the means (money, money) and the second the capacity and means (more money money, and the "far away thing" that has a lot of charm), but what about football? Come on guys! Iberia has 18 European club titles, or Champions Leagues, the place to be when you are talking about football clubs. Iberia received, in the last 10 years 7 Best player of the world titles, and two of them were actually born in Iberia (Ronaldo and Figo). Iberia has the second best european cup score, behind Germany. England didn't manage to get to the final. Finally, considering World Cups, yes it is true England already has one title, but besides the phantom goal, certain stadium change issues before the semi final against Portugal are well "underspoken".

Third - How is it possible to be the day before Portugal Spain in Cape Town and nobody has thought of possible implications of this to the Candidatura. I leave the discussion open!

Welcome Sosie...but you might want to look at other threads and posts before posting. Neither Australia or Qatar are bidding for 2018 (which is a lay down misere for a European host). The only non-European bid for 2018 is that of the US. 2022 will undoubtedly go to a non European host as per Sepp Blather's pronouncements on continental rotation etc.

Also, more subjectively FIFA don't make decisions on the candidature of any bid purely on the basis of the strength of the local teams (and if they did England's Premier League would easily supplant Portugal's and rival if not beat La Liga in Spain) or the status of the national team (why be in South Africa when Bafana bafana have never gone past the round robin phase).

Nice to see someone in here behind one of the back markers of the 2018 race, and looking forward to seeing more posts.

Edited by eusebius65, 28 June 2010 - 08:37 PM.

[SoSie]

In a way to promote the iberian bid, Portugal will face Spain on a friendly match November 19th. The game will be hosted in Portugal.

[Bic]

So with Spain winning the World Cup, do you think this is an advantage for the bid or not?

[RobH]

It can't hurt, but I doubt it's that big an advantage to have.

[Athan]

eusebius65, on 28 June 2010 - 08:33 PM, said:

Neither Australia or Qatar are bidding for 2018 (which is a lay down misere for a European host). The only non-European bid for 2018 is that of the US. 2022 will undoubtedly go to a non European host as per Sepp Blather's pronouncements on continental rotation etc.

And if the US hosted in 2018 (unlikely, I think), would the door be closed for Europe to host in 2022?


IMO, with this Spanish victory I think the Iberian bid for 2018 has become weaker. I'll explain. Spain has already won what they have been looking for for 100 years. They must be happy enough. Why giving them the WC when we can make another country happy, whose bid might be much more interesting than this joint Iberian bid? This is similar to what I think could happen to a possible Olympic bid from Spain if we were finally awarded the WC. Spain is not like Brazil or South Africa, we don't need to prove we can host big events to get the Olympics anymore. If the Iberian bid succeeds, I'm afraid the IOC could think we have enough with it and leave Madrid without the Olympics in 2020 or 2024 only because of that.

And let me say that I don't think Spain and Portugal are well communicated. There is no highspeed trains between Madrid and Lisbon, but there are no good roads enough to go from one country to the other either. I was born in a town quite near Portugal, but if I wanted to go there I had to spend over 3 hours by car only to get to the frontier...

[Cirdan]

High-Speed Rail from Lisbon to Madrid is already under construction, planned to be completed by 2013, and certain to be completed by the time of the World Cup. There's another line planned from Porto to Vigo, though there's no timeline for that as far as I know, might not be done by the time the world cup starts, though I think if the World Cup gets awarded, they'll get it done in time.

[SoSie]

Athan, on 12 July 2010 - 10:59 AM, said:

IMO, with this Spanish victory I think the Iberian bid for 2018 has become weaker. I'll explain. Spain has already won what they have been looking for for 100 years. They must be happy enough. Why giving them the WC when we can make another country happy, whose bid might be much more interesting than this joint Iberian bid? This is similar to what I think could happen to a possible Olympic bid from Spain if we were finally awarded the WC. Spain is not like Brazil or South Africa, we don't need to prove we can host big events to get the Olympics anymore. If the Iberian bid succeeds, I'm afraid the IOC could think we have enough with it and leave Madrid without the Olympics in 2020 or 2024 only because of that.

First of all, congratulations! I hope the bold sentence is not a push for another England title (they only too theirs at home) because they clearly don't deserve it .

One of the problems of a joint bid is confederations cup: if we were in 2014, this issue would be finish. Right know, the problem remains...